From: Olga Bourlin (fauxever@sprynet.com)
Date: Sat Aug 11 2001 - 21:47:12 MDT
> Zero Powers wrote:
> > Count me in. If nothing else it might help me to be more sympathetic to
> > such feminine issues as PMS [snip]
I'm a woman, and I've never encountered PMS ... or have ever gotten morning
sickness during any of my three pregnancies. I'm not saying these things
don't exist - but many women don't have many of these symptoms attributable
to their "womanliness," and that includes the "hot flashes" in later life.
Women with these symptoms are higher in noise level and profile ("news")
than those women whose symptoms are negligible to nil ("no news"), so
somehow the "news" gets painted onto "all" or "most" women?
and being viewed as a sex object (the latter
> > seems like fun to me!)
Samantha Atkins wrote:
> Being admired and even desired can be fun, depending on who is
> on the other end of course. Being generally seen as sexually
> attractive and desirable is something that all humans generally
> want and enjoy. But being seen as first and foremost a possible
> sex partner is just not fun. It is the "meat market" thing.
I've never understood the "meat market" analogy. Attractive women have
tremendous power, and if a woman has beauty + brains = the power is almost
incalculable. This seems like the flip side of the "discriminated white
male syndrome." An attractive woman with high intelligence who cries
"Victim, victim ..." somehow ... (but this is not to say there aren't real
"victims" of violence, tragedy, bad physical or mental health - irrespective
of demographics).
> One feels invisible as an actual person and seen only as an
> object of sexual desire. There is a big difference between
> being a "sex object" and being seen as a person who is among
> other things sensual and sexual.
Funny, some older women and men say there comes a day when they feel
"invisible" because they are NO LONGER seen as an object of sexual desire.
Be that as it may, it seems to me there is NO tremendous difference between
being a "sex object" or a "hand object" (in the latter case, e.g., of a
model whose hands are used in a nail polish advertisement). Our appendages
and our sexuality are a part of whole package.
> Also, from this end of the gender spectrum, there is the
> experience of being sexual prey, of being a target and possible
> victim of sexual predation. It feels quite different on this
> side in that respect. I don't think a lot of (more or less
> gender average) guys would enjoy that aspect very much. There
> is a pretty deep vulnerability in being female that we respond
> to in our different ways.
Women and men have many of the same vulnerabilities (death and taxes, ha
ha), as well as other vulnerabilities more typical for men (dangerous
occupational hazards, playing the role of "protector-hero") than for women,
and vice versa. In my opinion, many men are "victims" of "sexual
predation" in a somewhat different way than what is considered "sexual
predation" towards women. From my observations (all subjective, personal,
anectodal - acknowledged) women still "use" men to get what women want -
i.e., being taken care of, having children, having the children being taken
care of. Many women still tend to "sell" themselves to the highest bidder.
Things are getting better, though (but slower than I would have thought a
generation ago when I was young).
If I neglected to qualify "some" or "many" in talking about "men" and
"women" above - I never meant to imply "all" ... in any case.
Olga
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