From: J. R. Molloy (jr@shasta.com)
Date: Wed Dec 06 2000 - 13:57:44 MST
Dan Fabulich wrote,
> Extropy doesn't mean negentropy. Extropy is a normative term; entropy
> is a physical variable.
Okay, extropy means "the extent of a system's intelligence, information,
order, vitality, and capacity for improvement."
http://extropy.org/extprn3.htm
It sounds like entropy and extropy mean opposite things, because I thought
entropy was a concept related to the second law of thermodynamics.
"The second law is expressed mathematically in terms of the concept of
entropy. When a body absorbs an amount of heat Q from a reservoir at
temperature T, the body gains and the reservoir loses an amount of entropy
S=Q/T. Thus, in a reversible adiabatic process (no heat change) there is
no change in the total entropy. If an amount of heat Q flows from a hot to
a cold body, the total entropy increases; because S=Q/T is larger for
smaller values of T, the cold body gains more entropy than the hot body
loses. The statement that heat never flows from a cold to a hot body can
be generalized by saying that in no spontaneous process does the total
entropy decrease. 8
In all real physical processes entropy increases; in ideal reversible
processes entropy remains constant. Thus, in the Carnot cycle, which is
reversible, there is no change in the total entropy. The engine itself
experiences no net change in entropy because it is returned to its
original state at the end of the cycle. The entropy gained by the low
temperature reservoir is equal to the entropy lost by the high temperature
reservoir. However, according to the formula S=Q/T, less heat need be
expelled into the low temperature reservoir than is extracted from the
high temperature reservoir for equal and opposite changes in entropy. In
the Carnot cycle this difference in heat appears as useful mechanical
work." http://www.bartleby.com/65/th/thermody.html
> But, more generally, adopting transhumanism generally tends to provoke
> rather strong views about what society should look like. While
> extropians envision society with increasing extropy, there are a heck
> of a lot of transhumans who are technocratic, socialist, fascist,
> liberal democrats, conserative republicans, etc. (This is not name
> calling; most of those who are, for example, transhuman fascists
> self-identify that way.) Calling these views extropic is misleading
> at best.
If "extropians envision society with increasing extropy" it seems to me
that view can include transhumanism. Rather than misleading, I think that
calling the views of transhumanists extropic helps to establish some
common ground, and it also helps to update whatever paradigms attach to
old, established ideologies such as you list. In simplistic terms (I like
reductionism), entropy correlates to death and dying; while extropy
corresponds to life and living. Extropians can define extropy any way we
want to, obviously. I just think it's more extropic to include
transhumanism than to exclude it. Personally, I find both transhumanism
and extropianism to be more extropic than anything else except dhyana (a
Sanskrit word roughly translated as meditation).
Stay hungry,
--J. R.
3M TA3
"It is enough that the people know there was an election.
The people who cast the votes decide nothing.
The people who count the votes decide everything." --Joseph Stalin
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