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Thu, 20 Jan 2022 21:22:18 -0500 (EST) Received: by localhost (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 1126A5FB74; Thu, 20 Jan 2022 21:22:15 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2022 21:22:15 -0500 From: Peter Todd <pete@petertodd.org> To: Bram Cohen <bram@chia.net>, Bitcoin Protocol Discussion <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> Message-ID: <YeoY12X1skxA8Lcy@petertodd.org> References: <CAHUJnBBFsS597ZRdAtwONMAz1r7gQbrXULzdNtEVxOPENx+tDg@mail.gmail.com> <CAGpPWDYvvtCJLsr1SqghugfntnmnKw+GOtufp07d8sN-5vKa0w@mail.gmail.com> <CAHUJnBAfnmfs2nY3HFRhzNL6ztpZT3dgqe5wCxuO3qpk0OsgRg@mail.gmail.com> <CAGpPWDabAbY3nS-1QATrzLj+O4dxfs4Fo0EuYFftNdjw_gwRPw@mail.gmail.com> <CAHUJnBAFV6qFDjYkO_ByfDOp1rwz4S1xQc9hSJj5Jpsb7DdVwQ@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="lc8nEl9u8HRavgoQ" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <CAHUJnBAFV6qFDjYkO_ByfDOp1rwz4S1xQc9hSJj5Jpsb7DdVwQ@mail.gmail.com> Cc: Billy Tetrud <billy.tetrud@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Covenants and capabilities in the UTXO model X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion <bitcoin-dev.lists.linuxfoundation.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/options/bitcoin-dev>, <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/> List-Post: <mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> List-Help: <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev>, <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=subscribe> X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2022 02:30:54 -0000 --lc8nEl9u8HRavgoQ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 11:23:30AM -0800, Bram Cohen via bitcoin-dev wrote: > > Nodes currently aren't required to keep around the whole blockchain, but > > your proposal sounds like it would require them to. I think this could = be > > pretty detrimental to future scalability. Monero, for example, has a > > situation where its UTXO set is the whole blockchain because you can't > > generally know what has been spent and what hasn't been. Allowing > > references to old blocks would pull in all this old block data into the > > UTXO set. So unless you're very careful about how or when you can refer= ence > > old blocks, this could cause issues. > > >=20 > Don't full nodes by definition have to have the whole chain? This does ma= ke > pruned nodes difficult, but it could also have rules like you can only > point back so far. "you can only point back so far" leads to transactions becoming invalid, wh= ich is something we've always strictly avoided because it can result in huge problems during reorgs with transactions being unable to be included in a n= ew change. That's exactly why transaction expiry proposals have been shot down over and over again. --=20 https://petertodd.org 'peter'[:-1]@petertodd.org --lc8nEl9u8HRavgoQ Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCgAdFiEE0RcYcKRzsEwFZ3N5Lly11TVRLzcFAmHqGNAACgkQLly11TVR Lzckyg//S+KvFFxThm4OQxLEyMGRVIeQTgnqBG0H4uRPAEsohmkhbOIkOx+FWu8l saV0LyQaaq0vn0WYhDSmVsbU3x6Lr6Bu4uXBq4BAHUbOG9+Hba/5T5S/u1XYw/Rj jQLgdGnwAUa60pvFSWxGKeJjTnIxGax+XWTCT1/3+dWNsv1lGZunIt3cRhK9rQ94 eZSx0cjRqrnnZIxb1jbLaytSSS/h/G4PiCktOYQT5nNoN4rvjQ31rSGUifK+rWxO r00UjubQhCae34Hfkz2jf4BzWQezRJNSuIdbgdzerMsQ8BrGPBSOwV6glTNw5FiC JzLwGd+B8mFZImS+8Zbgh+BqYznBEUJ/EBGcn1opr7qeXUAN83wvpkvEh78lUIaN rKh2rsVOCCo/oeiqT6/0g2SsQyyTjGorpQGBvI23qfpoKWkrWYcqVJOAwI8S34VZ A6Bih02uCp5C7tObbEcw3pXcIsXoCfc4RdpkOCjxecYCcTKOnf8VldmXXaF0mpba ReWjIji4lzX0fdi4/b5gRVtoPny1VTs+/9GSeTZ8/qrFD8yKeyGQ9h96bcl6Kyas nkhCvgtW4WgzPeM06+00SvBu8hmYYnXlog80A4wKR4oVbWPBuwq2mXiBXfPjxqpg kqiXPH7OesYJSSj1YsjSCmY68FfGrONcr/kbHOJ2X06MbLhXvQE= =Nijo -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --lc8nEl9u8HRavgoQ--