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From: Billy Tetrud <billy.tetrud@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2022 05:53:36 -0600
Message-ID: <CAGpPWDY3vZ2JOsa1UhoT-z8kfxqkVWcq1nyt9Ah5ye6HE_6gOQ@mail.gmail.com>
To: AdamISZ <AdamISZ@protonmail.com>, 
 Bitcoin Protocol Discussion <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000d1fc3705d666bc93"
Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] PathCoin
Precedence: list

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There was a protocol someone mentioned a while back called Sabu that had
the same goals. As i recall, it had some pretty promising constructs, but
would have a critical vulnerability that could be exploited by miners. This
is the write up:

https://raymo-49157.medium.com/time-to-boost-bitcoin-circulation-million-transactions-per-second-and-privacy-1eef8568d180

Perhaps some of the techniques there could be combined with your ideas to
get closer to a solution.

On Mon, Jan 24, 2022, 08:51 AdamISZ via bitcoin-dev <
bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:

> Hello list,
>
> I took the time to write up this rather out-there idea:
>
> Imagine you wanted to send a coin just like email, i.e. just transfer data
> to the counterparty.
>
> Clearly this is in general entirely impossible; but with what restrictions
> and assumptions could you create a toy version of it?
>
> See this gist for a detailed build up of the idea:
>
> https://gist.github.com/AdamISZ/b462838cbc8cc06aae0c15610502e4da
>
> Basically: using signature adaptors and CTV or a similar covenant, you
> could create a fully trustless transfer of control of a utxo from one party
> to another with no interaction with the rest of the group, at the time of
> transfer (modulo of course lots and lots of one-time setup).
>
> The limitations are extreme and as you'd imagine. In the gist I feel like
> I got round one of them, but not the others.
>
> (I very briefly mention comparison to e.g. statechains or payment pools;
> they are making other tradeoffs against the 'digital cash' type of goal.
> There is no claim that this 'pathcoin' idea is even viable yet, let alone
> better than those ideas).
>
> Publishing this because I feel like it's the kind of thing imaginative
> minds like the ones here, may be able to develop further. Possibly!
>
>
> waxwing / AdamISZ
> _______________________________________________
> bitcoin-dev mailing list
> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
>

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<div dir=3D"auto">There was a protocol someone mentioned a while back calle=
d Sabu that had the same goals. As i recall, it had some pretty promising c=
onstructs, but would have a critical vulnerability that could be exploited =
by miners. This is the write up:<div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"aut=
o"><a href=3D"https://raymo-49157.medium.com/time-to-boost-bitcoin-circulat=
ion-million-transactions-per-second-and-privacy-1eef8568d180">https://raymo=
-49157.medium.com/time-to-boost-bitcoin-circulation-million-transactions-pe=
r-second-and-privacy-1eef8568d180</a><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div>=
<div dir=3D"auto">Perhaps some of the techniques there could be combined wi=
th your ideas to get closer to a solution.</div></div><br><div class=3D"gma=
il_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Mon, Jan 24, 2022, 08:51=
 AdamISZ via bitcoin-dev &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfound=
ation.org">bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><b=
lockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px =
#ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Hello list,<br>
<br>
I took the time to write up this rather out-there idea:<br>
<br>
Imagine you wanted to send a coin just like email, i.e. just transfer data =
to the counterparty.<br>
<br>
Clearly this is in general entirely impossible; but with what restrictions =
and assumptions could you create a toy version of it?<br>
<br>
See this gist for a detailed build up of the idea:<br>
<br>
<a href=3D"https://gist.github.com/AdamISZ/b462838cbc8cc06aae0c15610502e4da=
" rel=3D"noreferrer noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://gist.github.com/A=
damISZ/b462838cbc8cc06aae0c15610502e4da</a><br>
<br>
Basically: using signature adaptors and CTV or a similar covenant, you coul=
d create a fully trustless transfer of control of a utxo from one party to =
another with no interaction with the rest of the group, at the time of tran=
sfer (modulo of course lots and lots of one-time setup).<br>
<br>
The limitations are extreme and as you&#39;d imagine. In the gist I feel li=
ke I got round one of them, but not the others.<br>
<br>
(I very briefly mention comparison to e.g. statechains or payment pools; th=
ey are making other tradeoffs against the &#39;digital cash&#39; type of go=
al. There is no claim that this &#39;pathcoin&#39; idea is even viable yet,=
 let alone better than those ideas).<br>
<br>
Publishing this because I feel like it&#39;s the kind of thing imaginative =
minds like the ones here, may be able to develop further. Possibly!<br>
<br>
<br>
waxwing / AdamISZ<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
bitcoin-dev mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org" target=3D"_blank" =
rel=3D"noreferrer">bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev" =
rel=3D"noreferrer noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://lists.linuxfoundati=
on.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev</a><br>
</blockquote></div>

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