Return-Path: Received: from smtp3.osuosl.org (smtp3.osuosl.org [IPv6:2605:bc80:3010::136]) by lists.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CBFB5C0012 for ; Sat, 18 Dec 2021 02:00:47 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smtp3.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C842561106 for ; Sat, 18 Dec 2021 02:00:47 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at osuosl.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.197 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.197 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from smtp3.osuosl.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (smtp3.osuosl.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id CVg7AYU8MfS9 for ; Sat, 18 Dec 2021 02:00:46 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: domain auto-whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.8.0 Received: from outgoing.mit.edu (outgoing-auth-1.mit.edu [18.9.28.11]) by smtp3.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 94A5060EE1 for ; Sat, 18 Dec 2021 02:00:46 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-lf1-f51.google.com (mail-lf1-f51.google.com [209.85.167.51]) (authenticated bits=0) (User authenticated as jlrubin@ATHENA.MIT.EDU) by outgoing.mit.edu (8.14.7/8.12.4) with ESMTP id 1BI20hxu022611 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128 verify=NOT) for ; Fri, 17 Dec 2021 21:00:45 -0500 Received: by mail-lf1-f51.google.com with SMTP id d38so8334287lfv.0 for ; Fri, 17 Dec 2021 18:00:44 -0800 (PST) X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532bf8Bl8l/KhV9i9yONM4/My3h5kDfe+mX8DvUlT0pFAStK47BM FHM+rVvvAbyjqBRN3NQ7xkGli7p0oLrvlG5qgVE= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyT7JzlC4JewkhsQIdjK4tI7WaiVTyLrdzZeb3Q/AfN7M/rHijWVpG31q8iSiEhK3o7/9ymG4s+U8OxWSmfFnA= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6512:1113:: with SMTP id l19mr5246152lfg.247.1639792843417; Fri, 17 Dec 2021 18:00:43 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Jeremy Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2021 18:00:32 -0800 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: To: ZmnSCPxj Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000efed7305d36205b3" Cc: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] [Bitcoin Advent Calendar] Oracles, Bonds, and Attestation Chains X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2021 02:00:47 -0000 --000000000000efed7305d36205b3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Yep, these are great points. There is no way to punish signing the wrong thing directly, just not changing your answers without risk to funds. One of the interesting things is that upon a single equivocation you get unbounded equivocation by 3rd parties, e.g., you can completely rewrite the entire signature chain! Another interesting point: if you use a musig key for your staking key that is musig(a,b,c) you can sign with a until you equivocate once, then switch to b, then c. Three strikes and you're out! IDK what that could be used for. Lastly, while you can't punish lying, you could say "only the stakers who sign with the majority get allocated reward tokens for that slot". So you could equivocate to switch and get tokens, but you'd burn your collateral for them. But this does make an incentive for the stakers to try to sign the "correct" statement in line with peers. --000000000000efed7305d36205b3 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Yep, these are great points. There is = no way to punish signing the wrong thing directly, just not changing your a= nswers without risk to funds.

One of the interesting things is that upon a single equivocation = you get unbounded equivocation by 3rd parties, e.g., you can completely rew= rite the entire signature chain!

Another interesting point: if you use a musig key for your sta= king key that is musig(a,b,c) you can sign with a until you equivocate once= , then switch to b, then c. Three strikes and you're out! IDK what that= could be used for.

= Lastly, while you can't punish lying, you could say "only the stak= ers who sign with the majority get allocated reward tokens for that slot&qu= ot;. So you could equivocate to switch and get tokens, but you'd burn y= our collateral for them. But this does make an incentive for the stakers to= try to sign the "correct" statement in line with peers.
--000000000000efed7305d36205b3--