MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <CAAt2M1-fEnQxjX40c-sjUYpfLpJtS-fy5t244vUOZSb8Pm=MrQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <65F92B37-48C1-4CD5-8F17-47BF9BD231A9@gmail.com>
	<CAAt2M1-fEnQxjX40c-sjUYpfLpJtS-fy5t244vUOZSb8Pm=MrQ@mail.gmail.com>
From: Jameson Lopp <jameson.lopp@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2018 10:24:55 -0500
Message-ID: <CADL_X_cNdhydrn0D0vXSXK1s42dC7-n_7oW2TQJcpvkG6Oa0ow@mail.gmail.com>
To: Natanael <natanael.l@gmail.com>, 
	Bitcoin Protocol Discussion <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a113d2c22d68aff05651998c8"
Cc: =?UTF-8?Q?JOSE_FEMENIAS_CA=C3=91UELO?= <jose.femenias@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Possible change to the MIT license
Precedence: list

--001a113d2c22d68aff05651998c8
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

If I'm understanding the problem being stated correctly:

"Bitcoin is under a branding attack by fork coins."

The proposed solution is to disincentivize fork coins from using the word
Bitcoin by altering the license terms. I'm not a lawyer, but it seems to me
that the words of the license are basically useless unless there is an
entity that intends to make use of court systems to threaten noncompliant
projects into submission.

In my opinion, the perceived attack on Bitcoin here is social /
marketing-based, thus it makes sense that any defense against said attack
should also be social / marketing-based. I don't think that Bitcoin should
be reliant upon courts or governments to defend itself against attacks of
any form.

On Tue, Feb 13, 2018 at 9:25 AM, Natanael via bitcoin-dev <
bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:

>
>
> Den 13 feb. 2018 15:07 skrev "JOSE FEMENIAS CA=C3=91UELO via bitcoin-dev"=
 <
> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>:
>
> ***
> NO PART OF THIS SOFTWARE CAN BE INCLUDED IN ANY OTHER PROJECT THAT USES
> THE NAME BITCOIN AS PART OF ITS NAME AND/OR ITS MARKETING MATERIAL UNLESS
> THE SOFTWARE PRODUCED BY THAT PROJECT IS FULLY COMPATIBLE WITH THE BITCOI=
N
> (CORE) BLOCKCHAIN
> ***
>
>
> That's better solved with trademarks. (whoever would be the trademark
> holder - Satoshi?)
>
> This would also prohibit any reimplementation that's not formally verifie=
d
> to be perfectly compatible from using the name.
>
> It also adds legal uncertainty.
>
> Another major problem is that it neither affects anybody forking older
> versions of Bitcoin, not people using existing independent blockchain
> implementations and renaming them Bitcoin-Whatsoever.
>
> And what happens when an old version is technically incompatible with a
> future version by the Core team due to not understanding various new
> softforks? Which version wins the right to the name?
>
> Also, being unable to even mention Bitcoin is overkill.
>
> The software license also don't affect the blockchain data.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> bitcoin-dev mailing list
> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
>
>

--001a113d2c22d68aff05651998c8
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr">If I&#39;m understanding the problem being stated correctl=
y:<br><br>&quot;Bitcoin is under a branding attack by fork coins.&quot;<div=
><br></div><div>The proposed solution is to disincentivize fork coins from =
using the word Bitcoin by altering the license terms. I&#39;m not a lawyer,=
 but it seems to me that the words of the license are basically useless unl=
ess there is an entity that intends to make use of court systems to threate=
n noncompliant projects into submission.</div><div><br></div><div>In my opi=
nion, the perceived attack on Bitcoin here is social / marketing-based, thu=
s it makes sense that any defense against said attack should also be social=
 / marketing-based. I don&#39;t think that Bitcoin should be reliant upon c=
ourts or governments to defend itself against attacks of any form.</div></d=
iv><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Tue, Feb 13=
, 2018 at 9:25 AM, Natanael via bitcoin-dev <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org" target=3D"_blank">bitcoin=
-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=
=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padd=
ing-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"auto"><span class=3D""><div><br><div class=3D"gma=
il_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">Den 13 feb. 2018 15:07 skrev &quot=
;JOSE FEMENIAS CA=C3=91UELO via bitcoin-dev&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bit=
coin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org" target=3D"_blank">bitcoin-dev@lists.<wb=
r>linuxfoundation.org</a>&gt;:<blockquote class=3D"m_4333531158757201305quo=
te" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"=
>
***<br>
NO PART OF THIS SOFTWARE CAN BE INCLUDED IN ANY OTHER PROJECT THAT USES THE=
 NAME BITCOIN AS PART OF ITS NAME AND/OR ITS MARKETING MATERIAL UNLESS THE =
SOFTWARE PRODUCED BY THAT PROJECT IS FULLY COMPATIBLE WITH THE BITCOIN (COR=
E) BLOCKCHAIN<br>
***<br></blockquote></div></div></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div></span><d=
iv dir=3D"auto">That&#39;s better solved with trademarks. (whoever would be=
 the trademark holder - Satoshi?)=C2=A0=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></=
div><div dir=3D"auto">This would also prohibit any reimplementation that=
9;s not formally verified to be perfectly compatible from using the name.=
=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">It also adds lega=
l uncertainty.=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Ano=
ther major problem is that it neither affects anybody forking older version=
s of Bitcoin, not people using existing independent blockchain implementati=
ons and renaming them Bitcoin-Whatsoever.=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br>=
</div><div dir=3D"auto">And what happens when an old version is technically=
 incompatible with a future version by the Core team due to not understandi=
ng various new softforks? Which version wins the right to the name?=C2=A0</=
div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Also, being unable to eve=
n mention Bitcoin is overkill.=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div =
dir=3D"auto">The software license also don&#39;t affect the blockchain data=
.=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><div class=3D"gm=
ail_extra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"m_43335311587572=
01305quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-l=
eft:1ex"></blockquote></div></div></div></div>
<br>______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
bitcoin-dev mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org">bitcoin-dev@lists.=
<wbr>linuxfoundation.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev" =
rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://lists.linuxfoundation.<wbr>org=
/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-<wbr>dev</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br></div>

--001a113d2c22d68aff05651998c8--