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Date: Sun, 20 Dec 2015 22:34:06 -0500
Message-ID: <CADm_Wca33DiFjDttGz2YVzNMEfGKb7GwTz0BuFpz7UOThsnRYQ@mail.gmail.com>
From: Jeff Garzik <jgarzik@gmail.com>
To: Peter Todd <pete@petertodd.org>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=e89a8f83938742b86e05276029a9
Cc: Bitcoin development mailing list <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Forget dormant UTXOs without confiscating bitcoin
Precedence: list

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On Sun, Dec 20, 2015 at 11:35 AM, Peter Todd <pete@petertodd.org> wrote:

> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA512
>
>
>
> On 20 December 2015 08:30:45 GMT-08:00, Chris Pacia <ctpacia@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >On Dec 20, 2015 6:34 AM, "Jeff Garzik via bitcoin-dev" <
> >bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
> >
> >> 2) This reverses the useful minimization attribute of HD wallets -
> >"just
> >backup the seed"
> >
> >It would be nice if the bip37 filter matching algorithm was extended to
> >serve up the proof.
> >
> >And if server-based wallets did the same it would preserve the "just
> >backup
> >the seed" functionality.
>
> Exactly! The information will be out there - "just backup the seed"
> requires someone to have the exact same data needed to generate the
> TXO-unspent proof that my proposal requires to spend an old txout.
>
> tl;dr: jgarzik is incorrect; theres no difference at all from the status
> quo.
>

The data stored in the legacy case makes it possible to sign and send a
transaction without any connection to a network.  The data stored in the
upgraded case, absent grandfathering, requires significant network sync at
a minimum.

The user experience and security parameters are different.

Thus, issue/recommendation #1.

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<div dir=3D"ltr"><br><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quo=
te">On Sun, Dec 20, 2015 at 11:35 AM, Peter Todd <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:pete@petertodd.org" target=3D"_blank">pete@petertodd.org</a>&=
gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 =
0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED M=
ESSAGE-----<br>
Hash: SHA512<br>
<div><div class=3D"h5"><br>
<br>
<br>
On 20 December 2015 08:30:45 GMT-08:00, Chris Pacia &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:c=
tpacia@gmail.com">ctpacia@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt;On Dec 20, 2015 6:34 AM, &quot;Jeff Garzik via bitcoin-dev&quot; &lt;<b=
r>
&gt;<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org">bitcoin-dev@li=
sts.linuxfoundation.org</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; 2) This reverses the useful minimization attribute of HD wallets -=
<br>
&gt;&quot;just<br>
&gt;backup the seed&quot;<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;It would be nice if the bip37 filter matching algorithm was extended to=
<br>
&gt;serve up the proof.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;And if server-based wallets did the same it would preserve the &quot;ju=
st<br>
&gt;backup<br>
&gt;the seed&quot; functionality.<br>
<br>
</div></div>Exactly! The information will be out there - &quot;just backup =
the seed&quot; requires someone to have the exact same data needed to gener=
ate the TXO-unspent proof that my proposal requires to spend an old txout.<=
br>
<br>
tl;dr: jgarzik is incorrect; theres no difference at all from the status qu=
o.<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>The data stored in the legacy case m=
akes it possible to sign and send a transaction without any connection to a=
 network.=C2=A0 The data stored in the upgraded case, absent grandfathering=
, requires significant network sync at a minimum.</div><div><br></div><div>=
The user experience and security parameters are different.</div><div><br></=
div><div>Thus, issue/recommendation #1.</div><div><br></div><div><br></div>=
</div></div></div>

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