Return-Path: <j@toom.im> Received: from smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (smtp1.linux-foundation.org [172.17.192.35]) by mail.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DA2E7721 for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>; Wed, 9 Dec 2015 00:54:44 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: from auto-whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.6 Received: from d.mail.sonic.net (d.mail.sonic.net [64.142.111.50]) by smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5C234106 for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>; Wed, 9 Dec 2015 00:54:44 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [192.168.0.136] (1-64-179-042.static.netvigator.com [1.64.179.42]) (authenticated bits=0) by d.mail.sonic.net (8.15.1/8.15.1) with ESMTPSA id tB90sdcf015976 (version=TLSv1 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT) for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>; Tue, 8 Dec 2015 16:54:41 -0800 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_C1692F82-5447-4EE8-A6D5-47BC12BF9D74"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha512 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 7.3 \(1878.6\)) X-Pgp-Agent: GPGMail 2.5.2 From: Jonathan Toomim <j@toom.im> In-Reply-To: <201512082348.54788.luke@dashjr.org> Date: Wed, 9 Dec 2015 08:54:38 +0800 Message-Id: <52A2BDFA-FEEC-459F-A3CB-07F3DFAD0732@toom.im> References: <CAAS2fgQyVs1fAEj+vqp8E2=FRnqsgs7VUKqALNBHNxRMDsHdVg@mail.gmail.com> <5666FD8D.8050201@openbitcoinprivacyproject.org> <2030FF3C-4F65-44E6-A9D5-9CD144179994@toom.im> <201512082348.54788.luke@dashjr.org> To: Bitcoin Dev <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1878.6) X-Sonic-CAuth: UmFuZG9tSVYUBULRXZBrYZuxV/Dy5xtTRzmwILCRYq51mt6YmQYJTUIRHnq8tlUj6ICYcYjJidwJPqKLy0yzXJ6Rop37Rd1f X-Sonic-ID: C;XhLFbA+e5RGatsgxU3XIUw== M;+DQgbg+e5RGatsgxU3XIUw== X-Sonic-Spam-Details: 0.0/5.0 by cerberusd X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,HTML_MESSAGE, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW autolearn=ham version=3.3.1 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on smtp1.linux-foundation.org Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Capacity increases for the Bitcoin system. X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Development Discussion <bitcoin-dev.lists.linuxfoundation.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/options/bitcoin-dev>, <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/> List-Post: <mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> List-Help: <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev>, <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=subscribe> X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Dec 2015 00:54:45 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_C1692F82-5447-4EE8-A6D5-47BC12BF9D74 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_9D8289E2-6624-466F-B0ED-895A20847040" --Apple-Mail=_9D8289E2-6624-466F-B0ED-895A20847040 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii On Dec 9, 2015, at 7:48 AM, Luke Dashjr <luke@dashjr.org> wrote: > How about we pursue the SegWit softfork, and at the same time* work on = a > hardfork which will simplify the proofs and reduce the kludgeyness of = merge- > mining in general? Then, if the hardfork is ready before the softfork, = they > can both go together, but if not, we aren't stuck delaying the = improvements of > SegWit until the hardfork is completed. So that all our code that parses the blockchain needs to be able to find = the sigwit data in both places? That doesn't really sound like an = improvement to me. Why not just do it as a hard fork? They're really not = that hard to do. --Apple-Mail=_9D8289E2-6624-466F-B0ED-895A20847040 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii <html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html = charset=3Dus-ascii"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; = -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: = after-white-space;"><br><div><div>On Dec 9, 2015, at 7:48 AM, Luke = Dashjr <<a href=3D"mailto:luke@dashjr.org">luke@dashjr.org</a>> = wrote:</div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote = type=3D"cite"><span style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; = font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; = letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: = start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; = widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: = none; display: inline !important;">How about we pursue the SegWit = softfork, and at the same time* work on a<span = class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><br = style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; = line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: = 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><span style=3D"font-family: = Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; = font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; = orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: = none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline = !important;">hardfork which will simplify the proofs and reduce the = kludgeyness of merge-</span><br style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; = font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: = normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: = 0px;"><span style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; = font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; = letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: = start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; = widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: = none; display: inline !important;">mining in general? Then, if the = hardfork is ready before the softfork, they<span = class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><br = style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; = line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: = 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><span style=3D"font-family: = Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; = font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; = orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: = none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline = !important;">can both go together, but if not, we aren't stuck delaying = the improvements of<span = class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><br = style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; = line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: = 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><span style=3D"font-family: = Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; = font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; = orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: = none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline = !important;">SegWit until the hardfork is completed.</span><br = style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; = line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: = 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"></blockquote></div><br><div>So = that all our code that parses the blockchain needs to be able to find = the sigwit data in both places? That doesn't really sound like an = improvement to me. Why not just do it as a hard fork? They're really not = that hard to do.</div></body></html>= --Apple-Mail=_9D8289E2-6624-466F-B0ED-895A20847040-- --Apple-Mail=_C1692F82-5447-4EE8-A6D5-47BC12BF9D74 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Comment: GPGTools - https://gpgtools.org iQEcBAEBCgAGBQJWZ3vPAAoJEIEuMk4MG0P1cWgIAIl1d2LitOT2jzLCakyNbiMW tT4nli0q8b9nCWgISpsLCSRMN7jbEQNpjFr8XbsZleT8hEdO77UvjudwfVgFRPF5 mwbyirP2b4BMXW1515VVex7XZ9XRwBPvHqCgLAvjsYPgfWGQq2B9C07VY9VEBQLq PiiYEt0vgFQwSjAn/FRueP8756GLinSmUKZYPx7Cqdd3vpWEwoefk0O23ghLFEVn sDXMCnbZqLKNyq2jcM3afnlptDNBwtuhRKyjCmZMKGFOzUGmXw4jzYqE22Bhzlen pM29ZnJ2XWPmS7t7aYtyQeUnBfwXJ//iAwxqv1isXse+Kn4/Da+om/bV5UIwd7I= =FmOP -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Apple-Mail=_C1692F82-5447-4EE8-A6D5-47BC12BF9D74--