Date: Sun, 15 Jan 2023 13:04:05 +0000
To: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
From: alicexbt <alicexbt@protonmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] A new Bitcoin implementation integrated with Core
	Lightning
Precedence: list

Hi Michael,

If I were to fork bitcoin core and maintain an implementation, I wouldn't i=
ntegrate any lightning implementation with it. Instead remove some things f=
rom bitcoin core and keep it simple. There is also scope for improving priv=
acy. Example: https://github.com/bitcoinknots/bitcoin/issues/50

You might find the commits in this branch interesting if you are looking to=
 remove things from bitcoin core and maintain an implementation with no gui=
, wallet, less RPCs etc.

https://github.com/jeremyRubin/bitcoin/commits/delete-it-all


/dev/fd0
floppy disc guy


Sent with Proton Mail secure email.

------- Original Message -------
On Sunday, January 15th, 2023 at 1:56 AM, Michael Folkson via bitcoin-dev <=
bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:


> I tweeted this [0] back in November 2022.
>=20
> "With the btcd bugs and the analysis paralysis on a RBF policy option in =
Core increasingly thinking @BitcoinKnots and consensus compatible forks of =
Core are the future. Gonna chalk that one up to another thing @LukeDashjr w=
as right about all along."
>=20
> A new bare bones Knots style Bitcoin implementation (in C++/C) integrated=
 with Core Lightning was a long term idea I had (and presumably many others=
 have had) but the dysfunction on the Bitcoin Core project this week (if an=
ything it has been getting worse over time, not better) has made me start t=
o take the idea more seriously. It is clear to me that the current way the =
Bitcoin Core project is being managed is not how I would like an open sourc=
e project to be managed. Very little discussion is public anymore and decis=
ions seem to be increasingly made behind closed doors or in private IRC cha=
nnels (to the extent that decisions are made at all). Core Lightning seems =
to have the opposite problem. It is managed effectively in the open (admitt=
edly with fewer contributors) but doesn't have the eyeballs or the usage th=
at Bitcoin Core does. Regardless, selfishly I at some point would like a ba=
re bones Bitcoin and Lightning implementation integrated in one codebase. T=
he Bitcoin Core codebase has collected a lot of cruft over time and the ult=
ra conservatism that is needed when treating (potential) consensus code see=
ms to permeate into parts of the codebase that no one is using, definitely =
isn't consensus code and should probably just be removed.
>=20
> The libbitcoinkernel project was (is?) an attempt to extract the consensu=
s engine out of Core but it seems like it won't achieve that as consensus i=
s just too slippery a concept and Knots style consensus compatible codebase=
 forks of Bitcoin Core seem to still the model. To what extent you can safe=
ly chop off this cruft and effectively maintain this less crufty fork of Bi=
tcoin Core also isn't clear to me yet.
>=20
> Then there is the question of whether it makes sense to mix C and C++ cod=
e that people have different views on. C++ is obviously a superset of C but=
 assuming this merging of Bitcoin Core and Core Lightning is/was the optima=
l final destination it surely would have been better if Core Lightning was =
written in the same language (i.e. with classes) as Bitcoin Core.
>=20
> I'm just floating the idea to (hopefully) hear from people who are much m=
ore familiar with the entirety of the Bitcoin Core and Core Lightning codeb=
ases. It would be an ambitious long term project but it would be nice to fo=
cus on some ambitious project(s) (even if just conceptually) for a while gi=
ven (thankfully) there seems to be a lull in soft fork activation chaos.
>=20
> Thanks
> Michael
>=20
> [0]:=C2=A0https://twitter.com/michaelfolkson/status/1589220155006910464?s=
=3D20&t=3DGbPm7w5BqS7rS3kiVFTNcw
>=20
> --
> Michael Folkson
> Email: michaelfolkson at protonmail.com
> Keybase: michaelfolkson
> PGP: 43ED C999 9F85 1D40 EAF4 9835 92D6 0159 214C FEE3