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From: Chris Stewart <chris@suredbits.com>
Date: Sat, 18 Mar 2017 12:35:30 -0500
Message-ID: <CAGL6+mHPgtWt54Tv+7p1F7rqrf12cLPvUqsjQhhbyreaTmO8_w@mail.gmail.com>
To: Andrew Johnson <andrew.johnson83@gmail.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=f403045d9a2c807edd054b04b81d
Cc: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Requirement for pseudonymous BIP submissions
Precedence: list

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>I think this is an excellent idea. I consider myself to be extremely
data-driven and logical in my thinking, and have still fallen victim to
thinking "oh great, what's <person I've been annoyed by in the past> on
about now?" when seeing something posted or proposed.

I think we need to all recognize we are only humans -- thus susceptible to
our emotions influencing our decisions. The notion of identity is an easy
way to form judgements for/against an idea before thoroughly vetting it.

I also think a by product of this would be to curb reddit/twitter trolls
from talking about these protocol changes. It is a much less juicy story if
you have to say "9458b7f9f76131f18823d73770e069d55beb271b created a BIP to
propose a block size increase" compared to "Satoshi Nakamoto created a BIP
to propose a block size increase".

Note about the OP:

"The hash =E2=80=9C6f3=E2=80=A69cd0=E2=80=9D is just my..." should really s=
ay "The hash
'9458...271b' is just my.." Forgot to change the hash this morning.

On Sat, Mar 18, 2017 at 11:57 AM, Andrew Johnson <andrew.johnson83@gmail.co=
m
> wrote:

> I think this is an excellent idea. I consider myself to be extremely
> data-driven and logical in my thinking, and have still fallen victim to
> thinking "oh great, what's <person I've been annoyed by in the past> on
> about now?" when seeing something posted or proposed.
>
> And vice versa, it prevents people from being more partial to a bad or no=
t
> so great idea simply because it was posited by someone they hold in high
> regard.
>
> Simple, yet effective.  I would actually even go a step further and say
> that all BIPs should be done this way as a matter of procedure, I can't
> think of a downside.
>
>
> On Sat, Mar 18, 2017 at 10:46 AM Chris Stewart via bitcoin-dev <
> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
>
>> As everyone in the Bitcoin space knows, there is a massive scaling debat=
e
>> going on. One side wants to increase the block size via segwit, while th=
e
>> other side wants to increase via hard fork. I have strong opinions on th=
e
>> topic but I won=E2=80=99t discuss them here. The point of the matter is =
we are
>> seeing the politicization of protocol level changes. The critiques of th=
ese
>> changes are slowly moving towards critiques based on who is submitting t=
he
>> BIP -- not what it actually contains. This is the worst thing that can
>> happen in a meritocracy.
>>
>> *Avoiding politicization of technical changes in the future*
>>
>> I like what Tom Elvis Judor did when he submitted his MimbleWimble white
>> paper to the technical community. He submitted it under a pseudonym, ove=
r
>> TOR, onto a public IRC channel. No ego involved =E2=80=94 only an extrem=
ely
>> promising paper. Tom (and Satoshi) both understood that it is only a mat=
ter
>> of time before who they are impedes technical progress of their system.
>>
>> I propose we move to a pseudonymous BIP system where it is required for
>> the author submit the BIP under a pseudonym. For instance, the format co=
uld
>> be something like this:
>>
>> BIP: 1337
>>
>> Author: 9458b7f9f76131f18823d73770e069d55beb271b@protonmail.com
>>
>> BIP content down here
>>
>> The hash =E2=80=9C6f3=E2=80=A69cd0=E2=80=9D is just my github username, =
christewart, concatenated
>> with some entropy, in this case these bytes: 639c28f610edcaf265b47b06799=
86d
>> 10af3360072b56f9b0b085ffbb4d4f440b
>>
>> and then hashed with RIPEMD160. I checked this morning that protonmail
>> can support RIPEMD160 hashes as email addresses. Unfortunately it appear=
s
>> it cannot support SHA256 hashes.
>>
>> There is inconvenience added here. You need to make a new email address,
>> you need to make a new github account to submit the BIP. I think it is
>> worth the cost -- but am interested in what others think about this. I
>> don't think people submitting patches to a BIP should be required to sub=
mit
>> under a pseudonym -- only the primary author. This means only one person
>> has to create the pseudonym. From a quick look at the BIPs list it looks
>> like the most BIPs submitted by one person is ~10. This means they would
>> have had to create 10 pseudonyms over 8 years -- I think this is
>> reasonable.
>>
>> *What does this give us?*
>>
>> This gives us a way to avoid politicization of BIPs. This means a BIP ca=
n
>> be proposed and examined based on it=E2=80=99s technical merits. This le=
vels the
>> playing field =E2=80=94 making the BIP process even more meritocratic th=
an it
>> already is.
>>
>> If you want to claim credit for your BIP after it is accepted, you can
>> reveal the preimage of the author hash to prove that you were the origin=
al
>> author of the BIP. I would need to reveal my github username and =E2=80=
=9C
>> 639c28f610edcaf265b47b0679986d10af3360072b56f9b0b085ffbb4d4f440b=E2=80=
=9D
>>
>> *The Future*
>> Politicization of bitcoin is only going to grow in the future. We need t=
o
>> make sure we maintain principled money instead devolving to a system whe=
re
>> our money is based on a democratic vote =E2=80=94 or the votes of a sele=
ct few
>> elites. We need to vet claims by =E2=80=9Cauthority figures=E2=80=9D whe=
ther it is Jihan
>> Wu, Adam Back, Roger Ver, or Greg Maxwell. I assure you they are human =
=E2=80=94
>> and prone to mistakes =E2=80=94 just like the rest of us. This seems lik=
e a simple
>> way to level the playing field.
>>
>> Thoughts?
>>
>> -Chris
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> bitcoin-dev mailing list
>> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
>> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
>>
> --
> Andrew Johnson
>
>

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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div><div><div>&gt;I think this is an excellent idea.=
 I consider myself to be extremely=20
data-driven and logical in my thinking, and have still fallen victim to=20
thinking &quot;oh great, what&#39;s &lt;person I&#39;ve been annoyed by in =
the=20
past&gt; on about now?&quot; when seeing something posted or proposed. <br>=
</div><br></div>I
 think we need to all recognize we are only humans -- thus susceptible=20
to our emotions influencing our decisions. The notion of identity is an=20
easy way to form judgements for/against an idea before thoroughly=20
vetting it.=C2=A0 <br></div><div><br>I also think a by product of this woul=
d=20
be to curb reddit/twitter trolls from talking about these protocol=20
changes. It is a much less juicy story if you have to say &quot;<span class=
=3D"gmail-recipients-summary-label" title=3D"&lt;9458b7f9f76131f18823d73770=
e069d55beb271b@protonmail.com&gt;">9458b7f9f76131f18823d73770e069d55beb271b
 created a BIP to propose a block size increase&quot; compared to &quot;Sat=
oshi=20
Nakamoto created a BIP to propose a block size increase&quot;. <br><br></sp=
an></div><span class=3D"gmail-recipients-summary-label" title=3D"&lt;9458b7=
f9f76131f18823d73770e069d55beb271b@protonmail.com&gt;">Note about the OP: <=
br></span></div><span class=3D"gmail-recipients-summary-label" title=3D"&lt=
;9458b7f9f76131f18823d73770e069d55beb271b@protonmail.com&gt;"></span><br>&q=
uot;The
 hash =E2=80=9C6f3=E2=80=A69cd0=E2=80=9D is just my...&quot; should really =
say &quot;The hash &#39;9458...271b&#39; is just my..&quot; Forgot to chang=
e the hash this morning. </div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D=
"gmail_quote">On Sat, Mar 18, 2017 at 11:57 AM, Andrew Johnson <span dir=3D=
"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:andrew.johnson83@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">a=
ndrew.johnson83@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gma=
il_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-lef=
t:1ex"><div>I think this is an excellent idea. I consider myself to be extr=
emely data-driven and logical in my thinking, and have still fallen victim =
to thinking &quot;oh great, what&#39;s &lt;person I&#39;ve been annoyed by =
in the past&gt; on about now?&quot; when seeing something posted or propose=
d.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>And vice versa, it prevents people from b=
eing more partial to a bad or not so great idea simply because it was posit=
ed by someone they hold in high regard.</div><div><br></div><div>Simple, ye=
t effective.=C2=A0 I would actually even go a step further and say that all=
 BIPs should be done this way as a matter of procedure, I can&#39;t think o=
f a downside.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"=
><div><div class=3D"h5"><div>On Sat, Mar 18, 2017 at 10:46 AM Chris Stewart=
 via bitcoin-dev &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.or=
g" target=3D"_blank">bitcoin-dev@lists.<wbr>linuxfoundation.org</a>&gt; wro=
te:<br></div></div></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:=
0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div class=3D"=
h5"><div class=3D"m_5962357470901749598gmail_msg"><p name=3D"fd62" id=3D"m_=
5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-fd62" class=3D"m_596235747090=
1749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636=
760401gmail-graf--p m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf-af=
ter--p m_5962357470901749598gmail_msg">As everyone in the Bitcoin space kno=
ws, there is a massive scaling=20
debate going on. One side wants to increase the block size via segwit,=20
while the other side wants to increase via hard fork. I have strong=20
opinions on the topic but I won=E2=80=99t discuss them here. The point of t=
he matter is we are seeing the politicization of protocol level changes. Th=
e critiques of these changes are slowly moving towards critiques based on w=
ho is submitting the BIP -- not what it actually contains. This is the wors=
t thing that can happen in a meritocracy. <br class=3D"m_596235747090174959=
8gmail_msg"></p><p name=3D"fd62" class=3D"m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867=
636760401gmail-graf m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf--p=
 m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf-after--p m_5962357470=
901749598gmail_msg"><strong class=3D"m_5962357470901749598m_722211686763676=
0401gmail-markup--strong m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-ma=
rkup--p-strong m_5962357470901749598gmail_msg">Avoiding politicization of t=
echnical changes in the future</strong></p><p name=3D"da39" id=3D"m_5962357=
470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-da39" class=3D"m_5962357470901749598=
m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401g=
mail-graf--p m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf-after--p =
m_5962357470901749598gmail_msg">I
 like what Tom Elvis Judor did when he submitted his MimbleWimble white=20
paper to the technical community. He submitted it under a pseudonym,=20
over TOR, onto a public IRC channel. No ego involved=E2=80=8A=E2=80=94=E2=
=80=8Aonly an extremely
 promising paper. Tom (and Satoshi) both understood that it is only a=20
matter of time before who they are impedes technical progress of their=20
system.</p><p name=3D"0987" id=3D"m_5962357470901749598m_722211686763676040=
1gmail-0987" class=3D"m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf =
m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf--p m_59623574709017495=
98m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf-after--p m_5962357470901749598gmail_msg">=
I
 propose we move to a pseudonymous BIP system where it is required for=20
the author submit the BIP under a pseudonym. For instance, the format=20
could be something like this:</p><blockquote name=3D"36af" id=3D"m_59623574=
70901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-36af" class=3D"m_5962357470901749598m=
_7222116867636760401gmail-graf m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gm=
ail-graf--blockquote m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf-a=
fter--p m_5962357470901749598gmail_msg">BIP: 1337</blockquote><blockquote n=
ame=3D"89e3" id=3D"m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-89e3" cl=
ass=3D"m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf m_5962357470901=
749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf--blockquote m_5962357470901749598m_72=
22116867636760401gmail-graf-after--blockquote m_5962357470901749598gmail_ms=
g">Author: <a href=3D"mailto:9458b7f9f76131f18823d73770e069d55beb271b@proto=
nmail.com" class=3D"m_5962357470901749598gmail_msg" target=3D"_blank">9458b=
7f9f76131f18823d73770e069<wbr>d55beb271b@protonmail.com</a></blockquote><bl=
ockquote name=3D"9b18" id=3D"m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmai=
l-9b18" class=3D"m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf m_596=
2357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf--blockquote m_5962357470901=
749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf-after--blockquote m_59623574709017495=
98gmail_msg">BIP content down here</blockquote><p name=3D"4816" id=3D"m_596=
2357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-4816" class=3D"m_596235747090174=
9598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760=
401gmail-graf--p m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf-after=
--blockquote m_5962357470901749598gmail_msg">The
 hash =E2=80=9C6f3=E2=80=A69cd0=E2=80=9D is just my github username, christ=
ewart, concatenated=20
with some entropy, in this case these bytes:=20
639c28f610edcaf265b47b0679986d<wbr>10af3360072b56f9b0b085ffbb4d4f<wbr>440b<=
/p><p name=3D"fdcc" id=3D"m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-f=
dcc" class=3D"m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf m_596235=
7470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf--p m_5962357470901749598m_7222=
116867636760401gmail-graf-after--p m_5962357470901749598gmail_msg">and then=
 hashed with RIPEMD160. I checked this morning that protonmail can support =
RIPEMD160 hashes as email addresses. Unfortunately it appears it cannot sup=
port SHA256 hashes. <br class=3D"m_5962357470901749598gmail_msg"></p><p nam=
e=3D"fdcc" class=3D"m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf m_=
5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf--p m_5962357470901749598=
m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf-after--p m_5962357470901749598gmail_msg">Th=
ere is inconvenience added here. You need to make a new email address, you =
need to make a new github account to submit the BIP. I think it is worth th=
e cost -- but am interested in what others think about this. I don&#39;t th=
ink people submitting patches to a BIP should be required to submit under a=
 pseudonym -- only the primary author. This means only one person has to cr=
eate the pseudonym. From a quick look at the BIPs list it looks like the mo=
st BIPs submitted by one person is ~10. This means they would have had to c=
reate 10 pseudonyms over 8 years -- I think this is reasonable. <br class=
=3D"m_5962357470901749598gmail_msg"></p><p name=3D"769a" id=3D"m_5962357470=
901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-769a" class=3D"m_5962357470901749598m_7=
222116867636760401gmail-graf m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmai=
l-graf--p m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf-after--p m_5=
962357470901749598gmail_msg"><strong class=3D"m_5962357470901749598m_722211=
6867636760401gmail-markup--strong m_5962357470901749598m_722211686763676040=
1gmail-markup--p-strong m_5962357470901749598gmail_msg">What does this give=
 us?</strong></p><p name=3D"5cda" id=3D"m_5962357470901749598m_722211686763=
6760401gmail-5cda" class=3D"m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail=
-graf m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf--p m_59623574709=
01749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf-after--p m_5962357470901749598gmail=
_msg">This
 gives us a way to avoid politicization of BIPs. This means a BIP can be
 proposed and examined based on it=E2=80=99s technical merits. This levels =
the=20
playing field=E2=80=8A=E2=80=94=E2=80=8Amaking the BIP process even more me=
ritocratic than it=20
already is.</p><p name=3D"faa8" id=3D"m_5962357470901749598m_72221168676367=
60401gmail-faa8" class=3D"m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-g=
raf m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf--p m_5962357470901=
749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf-after--p m_5962357470901749598gmail_m=
sg">If
 you want to claim credit for your BIP after it is accepted, you can=20
reveal the preimage of the author hash to prove that you were the=20
original author of the BIP. I would need to reveal my github username=20
and =E2=80=9C<wbr>639c28f610edcaf265b47b0679986d<wbr>10af3360072b56f9b0b085=
ffbb4d4f<wbr>440b=E2=80=9D</p><p name=3D"a4fb" id=3D"m_5962357470901749598m=
_7222116867636760401gmail-a4fb" class=3D"m_5962357470901749598m_72221168676=
36760401gmail-graf m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf--p =
m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf-after--p m_59623574709=
01749598gmail_msg"><strong class=3D"m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760=
401gmail-markup--strong m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-mar=
kup--p-strong m_5962357470901749598gmail_msg">The Future</strong></p>Politi=
cization of bitcoin is only going to grow in the future. We need to make su=
re we
 maintain principled money instead devolving to a system where our money
 is based on a democratic vote=E2=80=8A=E2=80=94=E2=80=8Aor the votes of a =
select few elites. We
 need to vet claims by =E2=80=9Cauthority figures=E2=80=9D whether it is Ji=
han Wu, Adam=20
Back, Roger Ver, or Greg Maxwell. I assure you they are human=E2=80=8A=E2=
=80=94=E2=80=8Aand=20
prone to mistakes=E2=80=8A=E2=80=94=E2=80=8Ajust like the rest of us. This =
seems like a simple way to level the playing field. <br class=3D"m_59623574=
70901749598gmail_msg"><p name=3D"1227" class=3D"m_5962357470901749598m_7222=
116867636760401gmail-graf m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-g=
raf--p m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf-after--p m_5962=
357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf--trailing m_5962357470901749=
598gmail_msg">Thoughts? <br class=3D"m_5962357470901749598gmail_msg"></p><p=
 name=3D"1227" class=3D"m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-gra=
f m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf--p m_596235747090174=
9598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf-after--p m_5962357470901749598m_7222116=
867636760401gmail-graf--trailing m_5962357470901749598gmail_msg">-Chris<br =
class=3D"m_5962357470901749598gmail_msg"></p><p name=3D"1227" class=3D"m_59=
62357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf m_5962357470901749598m_722=
2116867636760401gmail-graf--p m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gma=
il-graf-after--p m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf--trai=
ling m_5962357470901749598gmail_msg"><br class=3D"m_5962357470901749598gmai=
l_msg"></p><p name=3D"1227" class=3D"m_5962357470901749598m_722211686763676=
0401gmail-graf m_5962357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf--p m_59=
62357470901749598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf-after--p m_596235747090174=
9598m_7222116867636760401gmail-graf--trailing m_5962357470901749598gmail_ms=
g"><br class=3D"m_5962357470901749598gmail_msg"></p></div></div></div>
______________________________<wbr>_________________<br class=3D"m_59623574=
70901749598gmail_msg">
bitcoin-dev mailing list<br class=3D"m_5962357470901749598gmail_msg">
<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org" class=3D"m_5962357=
470901749598gmail_msg" target=3D"_blank">bitcoin-dev@lists.<wbr>linuxfounda=
tion.org</a><br class=3D"m_5962357470901749598gmail_msg">
<a href=3D"https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev" =
rel=3D"noreferrer" class=3D"m_5962357470901749598gmail_msg" target=3D"_blan=
k">https://lists.linuxfoundation.<wbr>org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-<wbr>dev=
</a><span class=3D"HOEnZb"><font color=3D"#888888"><br class=3D"m_596235747=
0901749598gmail_msg">
</font></span></blockquote></div></div><span class=3D"HOEnZb"><font color=
=3D"#888888"><div dir=3D"ltr">-- <br></div><div data-smartmail=3D"gmail_sig=
nature">Andrew Johnson<br><div><br></div></div>
</font></span></blockquote></div><br></div>

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