Message-ID: <5590A432.9080102@AndySchroder.com>
Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2015 21:49:38 -0400
From: Andy Schroder <info@AndySchroder.com>
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To: grarpamp <grarpamp@gmail.com>, bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
References: <CAD2Ti2-QChRZYZDSH1avit3snCLMws2UNmHQ_aY5O4txCS3AGg@mail.gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Mailing List Administrivia - GPG, Archives,
 Breakage, TODO, mirrors, etc
Precedence: list

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Although I'd say your writing style is a bit unfriendly and hard to=20
identify/unclear at the specifics of some of your complaints, I do agree =

with many of your points.

I really have no idea what format the .txt.gz files are in that are on=20
the current archive. If you unzip them, they are not text tiles.

gmane was able to change the subscription of the previous list to the=20
current list. So, anyone who had a newsreader setup, it should be=20
working again. There is some gap in their archive at the beginning of=20
the archive, as well as last week while the list was transitioned. They=20
requested a link to a single mbox file archive that they can use to=20
restore the list archive in it's entirety. Anyone know how we can get=20
this? The reference to another mailing list below=20
(https://cpunks.org/pipermail/cypherpunks/) has such a link on its=20
archive page. It looks like the same interface so maybe that feature can =

just be turned on? I'm not sure if it gzips the mbox file on the fly=20
whenever an http request is made or if it has some schedule and may be=20
missing a few of the most recent messages?


Also, regarding the footer, if it can't be changed on a per user basis,=20
I'd vote to get rid of it. Anyone with a reasonably powered brain can go =

to lists.linuxfoundation.org and find a way to get to the bitcoin-dev=20
mailing list page. The information provided in the footer is also=20
included in the email message headers as well. It's also included in the =

welcome e-mail when someone subscribes to the list.


Andy Schroder

On 06/27/2015 06:21 PM, grarpamp wrote:
> On Sun, Jun 21, 2015 at 9:14 PM, Frank Flores <frankf44@gmail.com> wrot=
e:
>> If you're going to go through the trouble of signing your public email=
s ...
> ... then you should also demand that the official archives of your
> favorite lists preserve them and their verifiability in the supposedly
> canonical reference "mbox" format that they distribute.
>
> On Wed, Jun 24, 2015 at 7:47 AM, Wladimir J. van der Laan
> <laanwj@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Subject: [bitcoin-dev] New GPG signing key for Bitcoin Core binary rel=
eases
> http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2015-June/009045=
=2Ehtml
> http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2015-June.txt.gz=

>
> As you can clearly see, both the HTML archives and the "mbox"
> archives have corrupted this message, it will not verify. Do not
> try to say this case is trivial, the problem itself is not trivial,
> it's gratuitous, and it applies to all matching messages... text,
> code, binary inline... that's dangerous.
>
> Do not try to say this corruption prevents spam, it does not.
> Spammers simply subscribe to the list and harvest everything
> efficiently in realtime... no webcrawling overhead, no stale
> addresses. Obfuscation is futile.
>
> This misfeature needs to be disabled.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Jun 19, 2015 at 12:57 AM, Warren Togami Jr. <wtogami@gmail.com>=
 wrote:
>> archives will be exported
>> and imported into the new list server
> On Tue, Jun 23, 2015 at 2:45 PM, Andy Schroder <info@andyschroder.com> =
wrote:
>> I'm not sure if anyone has submitted a request for gmane
> On Sun, Jun 21, 2015 at 5:35 PM, s7r <s7r@sky-ip.org> wrote:
>> Do we have all the archives imported? I run several full nodes and
>> mirrors for open source projects, if you think it's useful, I can
>> provide a mirror for the mail list archives.
> Yes... these other mirrors, archives, analysis, journalism, and
> interfaces are useful. However, as it is now, there are no useful
> authoritative sources for them to seed from... they're all corrupt.
> And any subscribed realtime sources, though nice, are subject to
> downtime, administrative and other unrecoverable gaps. Your mirror
> project is a fine idea, you should demand that the pristine historical
> sources be made publicly available. Not just for you, but for everyone.=

>
>
>
> On Wed, Jun 17, 2015, grarpamp wrote:
>> ...
> As before, the current "mbox" archives are broken and not useful...
>
> a) They corrupt message data, messages are unverifiable, another exampl=
e...
>     http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2015-June/00=
9132.html
>     http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2015-June.tx=
t.gz
> b) They are missing the minimum set of original headers necessary
>     for fully replyable, threadable, sortable, searchable, context
>     preserving and direct use by users MUA's in their local environment=
:
>     (Date, From, To, Cc, Subject, Message-ID, In-Reply-To, References)
> c) They do not include attachments (patches, signatures, images, crypto=
,
>     data) that are absolutely necessary to the context and archives
>     of all lists. Instead they stupidly throw them away to "web links"
>     which results not only in uselessness of the so called "mbox"
>     version, but in many thousands of needless fetches by archive
>     users and indexers. And hours of wasted work attempting to
>     postprocess them into usable form.
>     Valuable content lost from the "mbox" files this June alone:
>      418 attachment.html
>      106 attachment.sig
>        6 attachment.jpe
>        4 attachment.png
>        2 attachment.bin
> d) There appear to be at least 15 instances of unescaped '^From '
>     in the "mbox". Regeneration with current mailman may fix. One such
>     case is here:
>     http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2014-January=
/004245.html
>     http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2014-January=
=2Etxt.gz
>
>
>
> Please fix all the above mentioned issues by providing the full raw
> archives in regularly updated [gzip/7z] mbox format. The internet
> thanks you :)
>
> Example, compare the "Downloadable version"s here:
> http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/
> https://cpunks.org/pipermail/cypherpunks/
> https://cpunks.org/pipermail/cypherpunks/2015-February/006820.html
>
>
>
> On Tue, Jun 23, 2015 at 2:45 PM, Andy Schroder <info@andyschroder.com> =
wrote:
>> Regarding message footers and the subject prefix
> Yes, they're also corruptive and space wasting clutter, for and by
> the clueless :( Both of them should be turned off.
> _______________________________________________
> bitcoin-dev mailing list
> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
>
>
>


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