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Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2024 10:14:52 +0000
To: Brandon Black <freedom@reardencode.com>
From: "'moonsettler' via Bitcoin Development Mailing List" <bitcoindev@googlegroups.com>
Cc: bitcoindev@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [bitcoindev] CHECKSIGFROMSTACK(VERIFY/ADD)
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Hi Brandon,

For what it's worth, I also think signature aggregation will be the dominant
form of CSFS use. LNhance at it's core is CTV + CSFS, and so it makes sense
to have both of those available in pre-tapscript.

No strong opinion on CHECKSIGFROMSTACKADD, agree with the general reasoning.

It's a bit weird to backport Schnorr this way, and the NOP upgrade path
leaving 3 elements on the stack is also unfortunate. On the other hand,
reverting CSFSV to use ECDSA in pre-tapscript would force us to consider
implementing script multisig, to do anything really worthwhile there.

BR,
moonsettler


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On Thursday, November 14th, 2024 at 11:02 PM, Brandon Black <freedom@reardencode.com> wrote:

> Hi list,
> 
> As we're working toward numbering and merge for the CHECKSIGFROMSTACK
> (CSFS) BIP, there are 2 open questions[1] that may be worth resolving
> before it is merged as a draft:
> 
> * Should CHECKSIGFROMSTACKVERIFY (CSFSV) be added to pre-tapscript?
> 
> The proposed opcode always evaluates BIP340 Schnorr signatures
> regardless of script version, so making it available in earlier script
> versions makes Schnorr signatures available on those script versions for
> certain use cases.
> 
> My personal thinking in initially including CSFSV in earlier script
> versions was basically that it's compatible with NOP forking, so why
> not. Because LNHANCE includes CTV which is designed as a NOP compatible
> upgrade, also including CSFSV fits well with CTV.
> 
> The other side of the argument is that we shouldn't include
> compatibility with earlier script versions unless there's a concrete
> benefit to doing so. For CTV, the possibility of bare CTV is a
> compelling reason to add it to earlier script versions, but there's not
> a similarly compelling reason to include CSFSV.
> 
> Using a scarce NOP to provide Schnorr signed commitments to earlier
> scripts may not be worthwhile.
> 
> 
> * Should we include CHECKSIGFROMSTACKADD?
> 
> Obviously, if script multisig is going to be a common use case for
> checking signatures on stack data CHECKSIGFROMSTACKADD simplifies the
> corresponding scripts by a few WU per key. As MuSig2 and FROST are
> progressing in standardization and implementation, I do not expect
> script multisig to be a dominant use for these opcodes, so I did not
> include CSFSA initially.
> 
> Here the argument is somewhat the inverse of CSFSV on legacy: We have
> many OP_SUCCESSes available, so the cost of allocating one for CSFSA is
> low, and the benefit is that making script multisigs with CSFSA (such as
> those produced by miniscript) is simpler and less error prone.
> 
> --
> 
> I would love to hear thoughts about both of these questions from the
> list, and will update the BIP and implementations of CSFS(V/A) based on
> your feedback.
> 
> Thanks much!
> 
> --Brandon
> 
> [1]: https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/pull/1535#issuecomment-2111195930
> 
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