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From: Steve Lee <steven.j.lee@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 10 May 2023 09:36:54 -0700
Message-ID: <CABu3BAdY20orgcb0vFvrSED34XE7jNzt_T5Pce5yX3xq_ErV7A@mail.gmail.com>
To: Michael Folkson <michaelfolkson@protonmail.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000007bc90705fb597b82"
Cc: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Bitcoin Core maintainers and communication on
	merge decisions
Precedence: list

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Blocking Vasil was discussed on a similar GitHub PR. Whether or not one
agrees or disagrees, the same process is being used. Anyone can NACK and
give a reason for Russ as well.

On Wed, May 10, 2023 at 8:55=E2=80=AFAM Michael Folkson <
michaelfolkson@protonmail.com> wrote:

> Hi Steve
>
> > Isn't this as simple as anyone (in particular Core project
> contributors) can express their view in this PR?
> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/27604
>
> Nope. The extent to which the rationale for blocking Vasil as a maintaine=
r
> applies or doesn't apply to ryanofsky (or future potential maintainers)
> isn't discussed. From now on the precedent is proposed maintainers can be
> blocked for unknown and/or potentially inconsistent reasons by the existi=
ng
> maintainers.
>
> Thanks
> Michael
>
> --
> Michael Folkson
> Email: michaelfolkson at protonmail.com
> GPG: A2CF5D71603C92010659818D2A75D601B23FEE0F
>
> Learn about Bitcoin: https://www.youtube.com/@portofbitcoin
>
> ------- Original Message -------
> On Wednesday, May 10th, 2023 at 03:44, Steve Lee via bitcoin-dev <
> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
>
> Isn't this as simple as anyone (in particular Core project contributors)
> can express their view in this PR?
> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/27604
>
> On Mon, May 8, 2023 at 5:03=E2=80=AFAM Bryan Bishop via bitcoin-dev <
> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
>
>> On Sun, May 7, 2023 at 12:36=E2=80=AFPM David A. Harding via bitcoin-dev=
 <
>> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
>>
>>> On 2023-05-06 21:03, Michael Folkson via bitcoin-dev wrote:
>>> > Essentially my concern is going forward current maintainers will
>>> > decide which proposed new maintainers to add and which to block.
>>>
>>> This is how a large percentage of organizations are run. The current
>>> members of a board or other governance group choose who will become a
>>> new board member.
>>>
>>
>> Yes but it's unrelated to what Bitcoin Core is-- a volunteer project of
>> independent contributors merging different pull requests or patches. The
>> github controls are merely because that is how github works. There is al=
so
>> a secondary issue of people tending to confuse Bitcoin Core with the
>> bitcoin protocol in general:
>> https://blog.lopp.net/who-controls-bitcoin-core/
>> https://medium.com/@bergealex4/the-tao-of-bitcoin-development-ff093c6155=
cd
>>
>> https://bitcoinmagazine.com/culture/a-primer-on-bitcoin-governance-or-wh=
y-developers-aren-t-in-charge-of-the-protocol-1473270427
>>
>> - Bryan
>> https://twitter.com/kanzure
>> _______________________________________________
>> bitcoin-dev mailing list
>> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
>> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
>>
>
>

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<div dir=3D"ltr">Blocking Vasil was discussed on a similar GitHub PR. Wheth=
er or not one agrees or disagrees, the same process is being used. Anyone c=
an NACK and give a reason for Russ as well.</div><br><div class=3D"gmail_qu=
ote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Wed, May 10, 2023 at 8:55=E2=
=80=AFAM Michael Folkson &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:michaelfolkson@protonmail.co=
m">michaelfolkson@protonmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=
=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rg=
b(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div style=3D"font-family:Arial,sans-serif=
;font-size:14px">Hi Steve</div><div style=3D"font-family:Arial,sans-serif;f=
ont-size:14px"><br></div><div style=3D"font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-si=
ze:14px">&gt;=C2=A0<span style=3D"font-family:system-ui,sans-serif;display:=
inline">Isn&#39;t this as simple as anyone (in particular Core project cont=
ributors) can express their view in this PR?<span>=C2=A0</span></span><a hr=
ef=3D"https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/27604" rel=3D"noreferrer nofo=
llow noopener" style=3D"line-height:1.5;text-decoration:underline;font-fami=
ly:system-ui,sans-serif" target=3D"_blank">https://github.com/bitcoin/bitco=
in/pull/27604</a></div><div style=3D"font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size=
:14px"><br></div><div style=3D"font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px"=
>Nope. The extent to which the rationale for blocking Vasil as a maintainer=
 applies or doesn&#39;t apply to ryanofsky (or future potential maintainers=
) isn&#39;t discussed. From now on the precedent is proposed maintainers ca=
n be blocked for unknown and/or potentially inconsistent reasons by the exi=
sting maintainers.=C2=A0</div><div style=3D"font-family:Arial,sans-serif;fo=
nt-size:14px"><br></div><div style=3D"font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-siz=
e:14px">Thanks</div><div style=3D"font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:14=
px">Michael</div><div style=3D"font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px"=
><br></div>
<div style=3D"font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px">
    <div>
        <div style=3D"font-family:arial;font-size:14px"><span style=3D"colo=
r:rgb(38,42,51);font-style:normal;font-weight:400;letter-spacing:normal;tex=
t-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:pre-wrap;word-spacing:0px;back=
ground-color:rgb(255,255,255);float:none;display:inline"><span style=3D"fon=
t-family:SFMono-Regular,Consolas,&quot;Liberation Mono&quot;,Menlo,monospac=
e,monospace"><span style=3D"font-size:14px">--<br>Michael Folkson</span></s=
pan></span></div><div style=3D"font-family:arial;font-size:14px"><span styl=
e=3D"color:rgb(38,42,51);font-style:normal;font-weight:400;letter-spacing:n=
ormal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:pre-wrap;word-spacing=
:0px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);float:none;display:inline"><span sty=
le=3D"font-family:SFMono-Regular,Consolas,&quot;Liberation Mono&quot;,Menlo=
,monospace,monospace"><span style=3D"font-size:14px">Email: michaelfolkson =
at </span></span></span><a href=3D"http://protonmail.com/" style=3D"line-he=
ight:normal;text-decoration:underline;font-family:SFMono-Regular,Consolas,&=
quot;Liberation Mono&quot;,Menlo,monospace,monospace;font-size:14px;font-st=
yle:normal;font-weight:400;letter-spacing:normal;text-indent:0px;text-trans=
form:none;white-space:pre-wrap;word-spacing:0px" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer=
" target=3D"_blank">protonmail.com</a><span style=3D"color:rgb(38,42,51);fo=
nt-style:normal;font-weight:400;letter-spacing:normal;text-indent:0px;text-=
transform:none;white-space:pre-wrap;word-spacing:0px;background-color:rgb(2=
55,255,255);float:none;display:inline"><span style=3D"font-family:SFMono-Re=
gular,Consolas,&quot;Liberation Mono&quot;,Menlo,monospace,monospace"><span=
 style=3D"font-size:14px"> </span></span></span></div><div style=3D"font-fa=
mily:arial;font-size:14px"><span style=3D"color:rgb(38,42,51);font-style:no=
rmal;font-weight:400;letter-spacing:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:n=
one;white-space:pre-wrap;word-spacing:0px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)=
;float:none;display:inline"><span style=3D"font-family:SFMono-Regular,Conso=
las,&quot;Liberation Mono&quot;,Menlo,monospace,monospace"><span style=3D"f=
ont-size:14px">GPG: <span>A2CF5D71603C92010659818D2A75D601B23FEE0F</span></=
span></span></span></div><div style=3D"font-family:arial;font-size:14px"><s=
pan style=3D"color:rgb(38,42,51);font-style:normal;font-weight:400;letter-s=
pacing:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:pre-wrap;word=
-spacing:0px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);float:none;display:inline"><=
span style=3D"font-family:SFMono-Regular,Consolas,&quot;Liberation Mono&quo=
t;,Menlo,monospace,monospace"><span style=3D"font-size:14px"><span><br></sp=
an></span></span></span></div><div style=3D"font-family:arial;font-size:14p=
x"><span style=3D"color:rgb(38,42,51);font-style:normal;font-weight:400;let=
ter-spacing:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:pre-wrap=
;word-spacing:0px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);float:none;display:inli=
ne"><span style=3D"font-family:SFMono-Regular,Consolas,&quot;Liberation Mon=
o&quot;,Menlo,monospace,monospace"><span style=3D"font-size:14px"><span>Lea=
rn about Bitcoin: <span><a href=3D"https://www.youtube.com/@portofbitcoin" =
rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://www.youtube.com/@port=
ofbitcoin</a></span></span></span></span></span></div>
    </div>
   =20
            <div>
       =20
            </div>
</div>
<div style=3D"font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px"><br></div><div>
        ------- Original Message -------<br>
        On Wednesday, May 10th, 2023 at 03:44, Steve Lee via bitcoin-dev &l=
t;<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org" target=3D"_blank=
">bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br>
        <blockquote type=3D"cite">
            <div dir=3D"ltr">Isn&#39;t this as simple as anyone (in particu=
lar Core project contributors) can express their view in this PR? <a href=
=3D"https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/27604" rel=3D"noreferrer nofoll=
ow noopener" target=3D"_blank">https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/2760=
4</a></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div class=3D"gmail_attr" dir=3D"=
ltr">On Mon, May 8, 2023 at 5:03=E2=80=AFAM Bryan Bishop via bitcoin-dev &l=
t;<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org" rel=3D"noreferre=
r nofollow noopener" target=3D"_blank">bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.or=
g</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;bor=
der-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote"=
><div dir=3D"ltr"><div>On Sun, May 7, 2023 at 12:36=E2=80=AFPM David A. Har=
ding via bitcoin-dev &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundatio=
n.org" rel=3D"noreferrer nofollow noopener" target=3D"_blank">bitcoin-dev@l=
ists.linuxfoundation.org</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><div class=3D"gmail_quote"=
><blockquote style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(20=
4,204,204);padding-left:1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote">On 2023-05-06 21:03, Mic=
hael Folkson via bitcoin-dev wrote:<br>
&gt; Essentially my concern is going forward current maintainers will<br>
&gt; decide which proposed new maintainers to add and which to block.<br>
<br>
This is how a large percentage of organizations are run.  The current <br>
members of a board or other governance group choose who will become a <br>
new board member.<br></blockquote><div><br>Yes but it&#39;s unrelated to wh=
at Bitcoin Core is-- a volunteer project of independent contributors mergin=
g different pull requests or patches. The github controls are merely becaus=
e that is how github works. There is also a secondary issue of people tendi=
ng to confuse Bitcoin Core with the bitcoin protocol in general:<br><a href=
=3D"https://blog.lopp.net/who-controls-bitcoin-core/" rel=3D"noreferrer nof=
ollow noopener" target=3D"_blank">https://blog.lopp.net/who-controls-bitcoi=
n-core/</a><br><a href=3D"https://medium.com/@bergealex4/the-tao-of-bitcoin=
-development-ff093c6155cd" rel=3D"noreferrer nofollow noopener" target=3D"_=
blank">https://medium.com/@bergealex4/the-tao-of-bitcoin-development-ff093c=
6155cd</a><br><a href=3D"https://bitcoinmagazine.com/culture/a-primer-on-bi=
tcoin-governance-or-why-developers-aren-t-in-charge-of-the-protocol-1473270=
427" rel=3D"noreferrer nofollow noopener" target=3D"_blank">https://bitcoin=
magazine.com/culture/a-primer-on-bitcoin-governance-or-why-developers-aren-=
t-in-charge-of-the-protocol-1473270427</a><br><br></div></div><div dir=3D"l=
tr"><div dir=3D"ltr">- Bryan<br><a href=3D"https://twitter.com/kanzure" rel=
=3D"noreferrer nofollow noopener" target=3D"_blank">https://twitter.com/kan=
zure</a></div></div></div>
_______________________________________________<br>
bitcoin-dev mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org" rel=3D"noreferrer =
nofollow noopener" target=3D"_blank">bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org<=
/a><br>
<a rel=3D"noreferrer nofollow noopener" href=3D"https://lists.linuxfoundati=
on.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev" target=3D"_blank">https://lists.linuxf=
oundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev</a><br>
</blockquote></div>

        </blockquote><br>
    </div></blockquote></div>

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