Return-Path: Received: from smtp3.osuosl.org (smtp3.osuosl.org [IPv6:2605:bc80:3010::136]) by lists.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0446C0032 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2023 15:30:08 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smtp3.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 78F0161263 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2023 15:30:08 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.11.0 smtp3.osuosl.org 78F0161263 Authentication-Results: smtp3.osuosl.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gap600.com header.i=@gap600.com header.a=rsa-sha256 header.s=google header.b=0cSH8hEX X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at osuosl.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.099 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.099 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from smtp3.osuosl.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (smtp3.osuosl.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id uu9--1zWvub7 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2023 15:30:07 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-ua1-x92a.google.com (mail-ua1-x92a.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::92a]) by smtp3.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CC5E761262 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2023 15:30:06 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.11.0 smtp3.osuosl.org CC5E761262 Received: by mail-ua1-x92a.google.com with SMTP id a1e0cc1a2514c-79a23db59c3so2052813241.2 for ; Wed, 02 Aug 2023 08:30:06 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gap600.com; s=google; t=1690990205; x=1691595005; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=wNp/jJbTbh5m24BRCqobmw00MWB4lE1Hpq9yv0gOrko=; b=0cSH8hEXFisn+gXfXDVCjFppMFVGjvrPRU5zg9fCLzOZOiW2SFiKA36ypH/IMLIjwt 9/tEwd8ZfAB59QayQjgvChh2j35HaWpb9w1nNDuAdijJiyN6bZSzMAS76pqRAVgPovv7 oqiQG0mLXFcVFLXAGN8K0Ob1BZ+6DjH8UnPxSGdhTMiJikJyXt9IhBQCHrZ1A3t2PMdo t1tmIyQ64Xdog1EVgPk3RmP0IJExanKKUWwT4NfsKcCx0oQR+Ewfl/NYdP20CCg+80cj krC2s8RruMLA00wXP8+DooUUkXfCTBtQDrznzw9/FDoAum8yIgD95yG4cXGTk5X6fgft C7dA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20221208; t=1690990205; x=1691595005; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=wNp/jJbTbh5m24BRCqobmw00MWB4lE1Hpq9yv0gOrko=; b=jczZz8Zy+XzOzulo9gjqLYwWH6G6yqRs9pvoYhgSZJLlnqCNzR4jD5PFLsIEe1aqeJ qFWOahFxy4PvU/Q1MChT2eR1C3Y5+vLhFE18t/ZdDXpmEXE1+kOUBr3ay3tKweozXYQd fQ2g7+HAT123HtZB4ujTD1+kud7MlhM3q218igROW2SjW/+8PVx3sH79BCpPKytdPdLt eDkeGRrGwSuLhn9Ek3f3dNDyuIzeo98+9eTr5vgGT7n8utwx4MOWVobGRUqja6IBGvTd H4aeVGpvgdlESl86BJJUPgvdhaHBFzXuE2OMebxeX/Ol7oUKCmhpOqFT2M9n/srAelUi 9ufA== X-Gm-Message-State: ABy/qLYXuz+F25CEnEZPIefOZnP5ByAUxxnJZbjZikGRqALC7euuloGp RKhZfDqJAE34+Kh2xch/2RL6k+rnnJ+sWtkPegyt6IgOXn6sw0/6sZM= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APBJJlG3fIviX0dkCEaBKpC78KeXiq2qP8Z2GwBTI4eksFfmzsuLcpRwc8qPwI+xzVBmTelH9ArJDeTw9OK9yhnFI64= X-Received: by 2002:a67:ed53:0:b0:443:72b0:6675 with SMTP id m19-20020a67ed53000000b0044372b06675mr3319277vsp.16.1690990205435; Wed, 02 Aug 2023 08:30:05 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Daniel Lipshitz Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2023 18:29:54 +0300 Message-ID: To: Peter Todd Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000083972d0601f2562b" X-Mailman-Approved-At: Wed, 02 Aug 2023 15:43:22 +0000 Cc: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Pull-req to enable Full-RBF by default X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2023 15:30:08 -0000 --00000000000083972d0601f2562b Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable For clarity purposes. 1. Our research is based on monitoring main net transactions and network activity - as too is our risk engine. We do not engage in specific hashi= ng pool assessments or research. 2. It is not easily possible or comfortable to engage with our clients to offer up their client names and applications - the competition is fie= rce and like other industries it is not an acceptable approach to ask. 3. The information offered by Coinpaid and posted on this list, provides root addresses which using tools like Chainanlysis, or similar service providers can confirm these addresses are associated wit= h Coinspaid. This can validate a significant amount of our traffic. 4. Based on the information provided it will be very possible to reach out to Max at Coinpaid - and will be able to confirm GAP600 use with Coinspaid. This is in addition to me posting an email from Max back in D= ec 2022 to this list confirming all of this information. 5. It is more than likely that Changelly has not implemented our service across all irts offerings, a large section of their business is servicing partners. ________________________________ Daniel Lipshitz GAP600| www.gap600.com Phone: +44 113 4900 117 Skype: daniellipshitz123 Twitter: @daniellipshitz On Wed, Aug 2, 2023 at 1:38=E2=80=AFPM Daniel Lipshitz = wrote: > Your assessment of my dishonesty is based on your assumption of how I > should be running GAP600, your assumptions are baseless and lack commerci= al > experience and likewise your conclusions are false. > > I have provided already back in December clear access to clarify opposite > our clients corroborated with easily verifiable trxs activity of a major > client of ours. This is more than enough to corroborate our statistics. > > As far as validating real RBF adoption I have offered a clear option here > https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/28132#issuecomment-1661960440 > something like this or similar would offer a clear assessment of adoption= . > Since you are not able to provide documents or public emails of hashing > pools confirming there adoption of Full RBF. > ________________________________ > > Daniel Lipshitz > GAP600| www.gap600.com > Phone: +44 113 4900 117 > Skype: daniellipshitz123 > Twitter: @daniellipshitz > > > On Wed, Aug 2, 2023 at 4:28=E2=80=AFAM Peter Todd wr= ote: > >> On Wed, Aug 02, 2023 at 01:27:24AM +0300, Daniel Lipshitz wrote: >> > Your research is not thorough and reaches an incorrect conclusion. >> > >> > As stated many times - we service payment processors and some merchant= s >> > directly - Coinspaid services multiple merchants and process a >> > significant amount of BTC they are a well known and active in the spac= e >> - >> > as I provided back in December 2022 a email from Max the CEO of >> Coinspaid >> > confirming their use of 0-conf as well as providing there cluster >> addresses >> > to validate there deposit flows see here again - >> > >> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2022-December/02= 1239.html >> > - if this is not sufficient then please email support@coinspaid.com >> and ask >> > to be connected to Max or someone from the team who can confirm >> Conspaid is >> > clients of GAP600. Max also at the time was open to do a call, I can >> check >> > again now and see if this is still the case and connect you. >> > >> > That on its own is enough of a sample to validate our statistics. >> >> Why don't you just give me an example of some merchants using Coinspaid, >> and >> another example using Coinpayments, who rely on unconfirmed transactions= ? >> If >> those merchants actually exist it should be very easy to give me some >> names of >> them. >> >> Without actual concrete examples for everyone to see for themselves, why >> should >> we believe you? >> >> > I have also spoken to Changelly earlier today and they offered to emai= l >> pro >> > @ changelly.com and they will be able to confirm GAP600 as a service >> >> Emailed; waiting on a reply. >> >> > provider. Also please send me the 1 trx hash you tested and I can see >> if it >> > was queried to our system and if so offer some info as to why it wasnt >> > approved. Also if you can elaborate how you integrated with Changelly = - >> I >> > can check with them if that area is not integrated with GAP600. >> >> Why don't you just tell me exactly what service Changelly offers that >> relies on >> unconfirmed transactions, and what characteristics would meet GAP600's >> risk >> criteria? I and others on this mailing list could easily do test >> transactions >> if you told us what we can actually test. If your service actually works= , >> then >> you can safely provide that information. >> >> I'm not going to give you any exact tx hashes of transactions I've alrea= dy >> done, as I don't want to cause any problems for the owners of the >> accounts I >> borrowed for testing. Given your lack of honesty so far I have every >> reason to >> believe they might be retalliated against in some way. >> >> > As the architect of such a major change to the status of 0-conf >> > transactions I would think you would welcome the opportunity to speak = to >> > business and users who actual activities will be impacted by full RBF >> > becoming dominant. >> >> Funny how you say this, without actually giving any concrete examples of >> businesses that will be affected. Who exactly are these businesses? >> Payment >> processors obviously don't count. >> >> > Are you able to provide the same i.e emails and contacts of people at >> > the mining pools who can confirm they have adopted FULL RBF ? >> >> I've already had multiple mining pools complain to me that they and thei= r >> employees have been harassed over full-rbf, so obviously I'm not going t= o >> provide you with any private contact information I have. There's no need >> to >> expose them to further harassment. >> >> If you actually offered an unconfirmed transaction guarantee service, >> with real >> customers getting an actual benefit, you'd be doing test transactions >> frequently and would already have a very good idea of what pools do >> full-rbf. >> Why don't you already have this data? >> >> -- >> https://petertodd.org 'peter'[:-1]@petertodd.org >> > --00000000000083972d0601f2562b Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
For clarity purposes.
  1. Our research is based on= monitoring main net transactions=C2=A0and network activity=C2=A0- as too i= s our risk=C2=A0engine. We do not engage in specific hashing pool assessmen= ts=C2=A0or research.
  2. It is not easily possible or comfortable to en= gage with our clients to offer up their client names and applications - the= competition is fierce and like other industries it is not an acceptable ap= proach to ask.
  3. The information offered by Coinpaid and posted on th= is list, provides root addresses which using tools like Chainanlysis, or si= milar=C2=A0service=C2=A0providers can confirm these addresses are associate= d with Coinspaid. This can validate a significant=C2=A0amount of our traffi= c.
  4. Based on the information provided it will be very possible to re= ach out to Max at Coinpaid - and will be able to confirm GAP600 use with Co= inspaid. This is in addition to me posting an email from Max back in Dec 20= 22 to this list confirming all of this information.
  5. =C2=A0It is mor= e than likely that Changelly has not implemented our service across all irt= s offerings, a large section of their business is servicing partners.
    6. <= /ol>________________________________

    Daniel Lipshitz
    GAP600|=C2=A0www.ga= p600.com
    <= font face=3D"tahoma, sans-serif">Phone:=C2=A0+44 113 4900 117
    Twitter: @daniellipshitz


On Wed, Aug 2, 2023 at 1:38=E2= =80=AFPM Daniel Lipshitz <daniel@ga= p600.com> wrote:
Your=C2=A0assessment=C2=A0of my dishonesty is base= d on your assumption of how I should be running GAP600, your assumptions ar= e baseless and lack commercial experience and likewise your conclusions are= false.

I have provided already back in December clear a= ccess to clarify opposite our clients corroborated with easily verifiable= =C2=A0trxs activity of a major client=C2=A0of ours. This is more than enoug= h to corroborate=C2=A0our statistics.=C2=A0

As far= as validating real RBF adoption I have offered a clear option here=C2=A0https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/28132#issuec= omment-1661960440 something like this or similar would offer a clear as= sessment=C2=A0of adoption. Since you are not able to provide documents=C2= =A0or public emails of hashing pools confirming there adoption of Full RBF.=
____________= ____________________

Daniel Lipshitz<= /font>
GAP600|=C2=A0www.gap600.com
Phone:=C2=A0+44 113 4900 117<= /span>
Skype: daniellipshitz123
Twitter: @= daniellipshitz

On Wed, = Aug 2, 2023 at 4:28=E2=80=AFAM Peter Todd <pete@petertodd.org> wrote:
On Wed, Aug 02, 2023 at 01:27:= 24AM +0300, Daniel Lipshitz wrote:
> Your research is not thorough and reaches an incorrect conclusion.
>
> As stated many times - we service payment processors and some merchant= s
> directly=C2=A0 - Coinspaid services multiple merchants and process a > significant amount of BTC they are a well known and active in the spac= e -
> as I provided back in December 2022 a email from Max the CEO of Coinsp= aid
> confirming their use of 0-conf as well as providing there cluster addr= esses
> to validate there deposit flows see here again -
> https://lists.= linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2022-December/021239.html
> - if this is not sufficient then please email support@coinspaid.com and ask
> to be connected to Max or someone from the team who can confirm Conspa= id is
> clients of GAP600. Max also at the time was open to do a call, I can c= heck
> again now and see if this is still the case and connect you.
>
> That on its own is enough of a sample to validate our statistics.

Why don't you just give me an example of some merchants using Coinspaid= , and
another example using Coinpayments, who rely on unconfirmed transactions? I= f
those merchants actually exist it should be very easy to give me some names= of
them.

Without actual concrete examples for everyone to see for themselves, why sh= ould
we believe you?

> I have also spoken to Changelly earlier today and they offered to emai= l pro
> @ changelly.com and they will be able to confirm GAP600 as a service
Emailed; waiting on a reply.

> provider. Also please send me the 1 trx hash you tested and I can see = if it
> was queried to our system and if so offer some info as to why it wasnt=
> approved. Also if you can elaborate how you integrated with Changelly = - I
> can check with them if that area is not integrated with GAP600.

Why don't you just tell me exactly what service Changelly offers that r= elies on
unconfirmed transactions, and what characteristics would meet GAP600's = risk
criteria? I and others on this mailing list could easily do test transactio= ns
if you told us what we can actually test. If your service actually works, t= hen
you can safely provide that information.

I'm not going to give you any exact tx hashes of transactions I've = already
done, as I don't want to cause any problems for the owners of the accou= nts I
borrowed for testing. Given your lack of honesty so far I have every reason= to
believe they might be retalliated against in some way.

> As the architect of such a major change to the status of 0-conf
> transactions I would think you would welcome the opportunity to speak = to
> business and users who actual activities will be impacted by full RBF<= br> > becoming dominant.

Funny how you say this, without actually giving any concrete examples of businesses that will be affected. Who exactly are these businesses? Payment=
processors obviously don't count.

> Are you able to provide the same i.e emails and contacts of people at<= br> > the mining pools who can confirm they have adopted FULL RBF ?

I've already had multiple mining pools complain to me that they and the= ir
employees have been harassed over full-rbf, so obviously I'm not going = to
provide you with any private contact information I have. There's no nee= d to
expose them to further harassment.

If you actually offered an unconfirmed transaction guarantee service, with = real
customers getting an actual benefit, you'd be doing test transactions frequently and would already have a very good idea of what pools do full-rb= f.
Why don't you already have this data?

--
http= s://petertodd.org 'peter'[:-1]@petertodd.org
--00000000000083972d0601f2562b--