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From: slush <slush@centrum.cz>
Date: Mon, 19 Dec 2011 02:44:42 +0100
Message-ID: <CAJna-HjyZv2y9grNdnKKG8k6tn7jdW=zL=vtrALpeW8jkuzV6Q@mail.gmail.com>
To: Pieter Wuille <pieter.wuille@gmail.com>
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Cc: bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net
Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] [BIP 15] Aliases
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Pieter, it was more rhetorical question than asking for explanation, but
thanks anyway. As an Internet application developer, I of course understand
security issues while using HTTPS and CA.

I have a gut feeling that there simply does not exist any single solution
which is both easy to use and secure enough. At least nobody mentioned it
yet. And if I need to choose between easy solution or secure solution for
aliases, I'll pick that easy one. I mean - we need some solution which will
be easy enough for daily use; it is something what we currently don't have.
But if I want to be really really sure I'm using correct destination for
paying $1mil for a house, I can every time ask for real bitcoin addresses,
this is that secure way which we currently have.

slush

On Mon, Dec 19, 2011 at 2:14 AM, Pieter Wuille <pieter.wuille@gmail.com>wrote:

> On Mon, Dec 19, 2011 at 12:58:37AM +0100, slush wrote:
> > Maybe I'm retarded, but where's the point in providing alliases
> containing
> > yet another hash in URL?
>
> Any DNS-based alias system is vulnerable to spoofing. If I can make
> people's
> DNS server believe that mining.cz points to my IP, I'll receive payments
> to
> you...
>
> If no trusted CA is used to authenticate the communication, there is no way
> to be sure the one you are asking how to pay, is the person you want to
> pay.
> Therefore, one solution is to put a bitcoin address in the identification
> string itself, and requiring SSL communication authenticated using the
> respective key.
>
> This makes the identification strings obviously less useful as aliases,
> but pure aliases in the sense of human-typable strings have imho
> limited usefulness anyway - in most cases these identification strings
> will be communicated through other electronic means anyway.
>
> Furthermore, the embedded bitcoin address could be hidden from the user:
> retrieved when first connecting, and stored together with the URI in
> an address book. Like ssh, it could warn the user if the key changes
> (which wil be ignored by most users anyway, but what do you do about
> that?)
>
> --
> Pieter
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Learn Windows Azure Live!  Tuesday, Dec 13, 2011
> Microsoft is holding a special Learn Windows Azure training event for
> developers. It will provide a great way to learn Windows Azure and what it
> provides. You can attend the event by watching it streamed LIVE online.
> Learn more at http://p.sf.net/sfu/ms-windowsazure
> _______________________________________________
> Bitcoin-development mailing list
> Bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>

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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Pieter, it was more rhetorical question than asking for explanation, but th=
anks anyway. As an Internet application developer, I of course understand s=
ecurity issues while using HTTPS and CA.<div><br></div><div>I have a gut fe=
eling that there simply does not exist any single solution which is both ea=
sy to use and secure enough. At least nobody mentioned it yet. And if I nee=
d to choose between easy solution or secure solution for aliases, I&#39;ll =
pick that easy one. I mean - we need some solution which will be easy enoug=
h for daily use; it is something what we currently don&#39;t have. But if I=
 want to be really really sure I&#39;m using correct destination for paying=
 $1mil for a house, I can every time ask for real bitcoin addresses, this i=
s that secure way which we currently have.=A0</div>

<div><br></div><div>slush<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Mon, Dec 19,=
 2011 at 2:14 AM, Pieter Wuille <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:pie=
ter.wuille@gmail.com">pieter.wuille@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blo=
ckquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #c=
cc solid;padding-left:1ex">

<div class=3D"im">On Mon, Dec 19, 2011 at 12:58:37AM +0100, slush wrote:<br=
>
&gt; Maybe I&#39;m retarded, but where&#39;s the point in providing alliase=
s containing<br>
&gt; yet another hash in URL?<br>
<br>
</div>Any DNS-based alias system is vulnerable to spoofing. If I can make p=
eople&#39;s<br>
DNS server believe that <a href=3D"http://mining.cz" target=3D"_blank">mini=
ng.cz</a> points to my IP, I&#39;ll receive payments to<br>
you...<br>
<br>
If no trusted CA is used to authenticate the communication, there is no way=
<br>
to be sure the one you are asking how to pay, is the person you want to pay=
.<br>
Therefore, one solution is to put a bitcoin address in the identification<b=
r>
string itself, and requiring SSL communication authenticated using the<br>
respective key.<br>
<br>
This makes the identification strings obviously less useful as aliases,<br>
but pure aliases in the sense of human-typable strings have imho<br>
limited usefulness anyway - in most cases these identification strings<br>
will be communicated through other electronic means anyway.<br>
<br>
Furthermore, the embedded bitcoin address could be hidden from the user:<br=
>
retrieved when first connecting, and stored together with the URI in<br>
an address book. Like ssh, it could warn the user if the key changes<br>
(which wil be ignored by most users anyway, but what do you do about<br>
that?)<br>
<span class=3D"HOEnZb"><font color=3D"#888888"><br>
--<br>
Pieter<br>
</font></span><div class=3D"HOEnZb"><div class=3D"h5"><br>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------=
---<br>
Learn Windows Azure Live! =A0Tuesday, Dec 13, 2011<br>
Microsoft is holding a special Learn Windows Azure training event for<br>
developers. It will provide a great way to learn Windows Azure and what it<=
br>
provides. You can attend the event by watching it streamed LIVE online.<br>
Learn more at <a href=3D"http://p.sf.net/sfu/ms-windowsazure" target=3D"_bl=
ank">http://p.sf.net/sfu/ms-windowsazure</a><br>
_______________________________________________<br>
Bitcoin-development mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net">Bitcoin-develo=
pment@lists.sourceforge.net</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development=
" target=3D"_blank">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-de=
velopment</a><br>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br></div>

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